[ember.m4]

Has anyone managed to figure out how to code the M Drive Professional option yet? I've seen old threads about this topic, but no successful attempts from what I have found. It'd be nice to unlock the 10 stage traction + track mode.

[kjx]

From someone's prior research here, it's not just software, there are some hardware differences too. And yes, no one's made it happen yet that people here are aware of. Someone escalated all the way to BMW engineering in Germany and basically got shot down. You've probably seen all the threads.

These threads are a reminder to not skimp on options when buying the car. And yeah, it sucks for second-hand buyers.

[ember.m4]

Originally Posted by kjx

From someone's prior research here, it's not just software, there are some hardware differences too. And yes, no one's made it happen yet that people here are aware of. Someone escalated all the way to BMW engineering in Germany and basically got shot down. You've probably seen all the threads.

These threads are a reminder to not skimp on options when buying the car. And yeah, it sucks for second-hand buyers.

I'm highly skeptical that there are hardware differences for an option like this, and would love to see evidence of this if you have any (part numbers etc.). This is about as obscure as options go (fine-grained TC settings and drift display in RWD only, option to turn off your screen on track).

Logically, everything needed for this is already in the car. Every one of these cars have yaw sensors, can already detect wheel slip, and can already intervene. DSC includes TC, and DSC is standard in every car. Factor into this the fact that BMW has historically loved to paywall niche features behind software locks.

As for skimping on features, this feature isn't worth $900 to me personally. Maybe if you're a drift fiend it would be, or you love to drive RWD on your AWD car for some reason. However, if it's free, I'd certainly like to play around with it out on the track for fun. Also posting this to help bring awareness for lot-buyers/second-hand owners, as you mentioned.

[kjx]

Originally Posted by ember.m4

I'm highly skeptical that there are hardware differences for an option like this, and would love to see evidence of this if you have any (part numbers etc.). This is about as obscure as options go (fine-grained TC settings and drift display in RWD only, option to turn off your screen on track).

Logically, everything needed for this is already in the car. Every one of these cars have yaw sensors, can already detect wheel slip, and can already intervene. DSC includes TC, and DSC is standard in every car. Factor into this the fact that BMW has historically loved to paywall niche features behind software locks.

As for skimping on features, this feature isn't worth $900 to me personally. Maybe if you're a drift fiend it would be, or you love to drive RWD on your AWD car for some reason. However, if it's free, I'd certainly like to play around with it out on the track for fun. Also posting this to help bring awareness for lot-buyers/second-hand owners, as you mentioned.

You can try VO coding the option using something like BimmerUtility. From what I remember (vaguely) people were able to make options show up on iDrive but they functionally did nothing to the car.

Tried looking it up and saw you were already on that thread in April. The best coders haven’t figured it out and even tuners with unlocked ECUs haven’t offered it so I think it’s fair to assume that, if not specced from the factory, you’re SOL. People may be motivated to figure it out if they could make thousands of dollars (per customer). But the kind of person (statistically at scale) who skimped on $900 in the first place is hardly likely to give them a fraction of that $900 for the same outcome.

Take the value of your time and multiply it by the hours you’ve spent thinking about and researching this - if achieved, that’s the cost of the option to you. And then restoring it with every update. If not achieved, that’s all just wasted time (=money). Though I’ve never used it, $900 was worth never having to think about it for me.

[ember.m4]

Originally Posted by kjx

You can try VO coding the option using something like BimmerUtility. From what I remember (vaguely) people were able to make options show up on iDrive but they functionally did nothing to the car.

Tried looking it up and saw you were already on that thread in April. The best coders haven’t figured it out and even tuners with unlocked ECUs haven’t offered it so I think it’s fair to assume that, if not specced from the factory, you’re SOL. People may be motivated to figure it out if they could make thousands of dollars (per customer). But the kind of person (statistically at scale) who skimped on $900 in the first place is hardly likely to give them a fraction of that $900 for the same outcome.

Take the value of your time and multiply it by the hours you’ve spent thinking about and researching this - if achieved, that’s the cost of the option to you. And then restoring it with every update. If not achieved, that’s all just wasted time (=money). Though I’ve never used it, $900 was worth never having to think about it for me.

Yup, totally fair perspective. Personally, I like the struggle. I like to tinker, research, and talk with other people that enjoy similar things. I've already got everything I need in the car, so now I focus on the nice extras that I don't really need. If I had optioned this, I'd be spending the same energy on something different. The journey is more fun than the destination for me.

You're right that the economics may not incentive a business enough to pursue this, and that's why I'm asking the enthusiasts, not the businesses. There are people on here that do this stuff for fun and to give back to the community. I myself post plenty of reviews and information without ever expecting anything in return. That's what makes internet communities so great! We're just a bunch of clueless guys trying to figure it all out together.

[somer]

Assuming it's for track use? Do you find 4WD Sport too intrusive?

[ember.m4]

Originally Posted by somer

Assuming it's for track use? Do you find 4WD Sport too intrusive?

I drive in 4WD Sport when I want to set a fast laptime. The rear bias helps with rotation on sharp corners, and the power to the front axle helps with mid-corner + exit.

10-stage traction can only be turned on in RWD mode, so it's more of a fun option to toy around with than a practical one. That's also why I didn't pay $900 for it, but if I can get it for free I'd certainly like to try it out

[Forzanerazzurri]

Pay up front like the rest of us.

[Berzerker]

Originally Posted by ember.m4

I'm highly skeptical that there are hardware differences for an option like this, and would love to see evidence of this if you have any (part numbers etc.). This is about as obscure as options go (fine-grained TC settings and drift display in RWD only, option to turn off your screen on track).

Logically, everything needed for this is already in the car. Every one of these cars have yaw sensors, can already detect wheel slip, and can already intervene. DSC includes TC, and DSC is standard in every car. Factor into this the fact that BMW has historically loved to paywall niche features behind software locks.

As for skimping on features, this feature isn't worth $900 to me personally. Maybe if you're a drift fiend it would be, or you love to drive RWD on your AWD car for some reason. However, if it's free, I'd certainly like to play around with it out on the track for fun. Also posting this to help bring awareness for lot-buyers/second-hand owners, as you mentioned.

There's definitely hardware differences. There's a slip controller that doesn't exist without the package (part of why it's $900 and not $100 like the drive recorder). There's also various hardware control aspects of the different levels of TC. I've attached the details of what the different levels do.

[ember.m4]

Originally Posted by Berzerker

There's definitely hardware differences. There's a slip controller that doesn't exist without the package (part of why it's $900 and not $100 like the drive recorder). There's also various hardware control aspects of the different levels of TC. I've attached the details of what the different levels do.

LOL aite, speculation is one thing, but let's not state a theory as fact and then post a random page from the manual as supporting evidence.

Slip controller lmfao, bro, we all have eLSDs in these cars. How do you think MDM works? BMW literally states MDM switches between M TC levels 4-7 depending on yaw.

https://www.bmw-m.com/en/topics/maga...n-control.html

Direct quote:

MDM uses M Traction Control levels 4 to 7 depending on yaw rate behaviour.

[ember.m4]

Originally Posted by Forzanerazzurri

Pay up front like the rest of us.

Thank you for this productive comment. I'm sure you'd be happy to pay for heat seating subscriptions too. Like I've mentioned, some people bought lot cars or got their cars secondhand. BMW doesn't offer this retroactively, so paying up isn't an option for many folks. If they can have it too, why not let them? Because you paid $900 and want to feel exclusive? Come on. Everyone can win here.

[kgelfen360]

They should just sell after the fact in the app. As software push. Don’t see why not.

[Forzanerazzurri]

Originally Posted by ember.m4

Thank you for this productive comment. I'm sure you'd be happy to pay for heat seating subscriptions too. Like I've mentioned, some people bought lot cars or got their cars secondhand. BMW doesn't offer this retroactively, so paying up isn't an option for many folks. If they can have it too, why not let them? Because you paid $900 and want to feel exclusive? Come on. Everyone can win here.

What does this have to do with buying the car used? What does this have to do with a subscription charge? If you want the feature and you are buying one used then find one that has the feature or buy it new and pay up and order it like the rest of us. This is also an option not a subscription.

Hope that clarification was productive enough for you.

[Berzerker]

Originally Posted by ember.m4

LOL aite, speculation is one thing, but let's not state a theory as fact and then post a random page from the manual as supporting evidence.

Slip controller lmfao, bro, we all have eLSDs in these cars. How do you think MDM works? BMW literally states MDM switches between M TC levels 4-7 depending on yaw.

https://www.bmw-m.com/en/topics/maga...n-control.html

Direct quote:

I don't know what to tell if you if you're actively going against BMW's literature/guidance. The fact is, there's hardware differences, that's objectively undisputed. You can be skeptical all you want, you're wrong.

And your MDM comment is only relevant if you have the M Drive Professional. Without it, MDM gives a feeling *similar* to what 4-7 would do.

[ember.m4]

Originally Posted by Berzerker

There's definitely hardware differences. There's a slip controller that doesn't exist without the package (part of why it's $900 and not $100 like the drive recorder). There's also various hardware control aspects of the different levels of TC. I've attached the details of what the different levels do.

Originally Posted by Berzerker

I don't know what to tell if you if you're actively going against BMW's literature/guidance. The fact is, there's hardware differences, that's objectively undisputed. You can be skeptical all you want, you're wrong.

You're right, the evidence is truly indisputable. I must see past my denial. If you don't option M Traction Control, then MDM uses lvls 4-7 by connecting to the BMW cloud through 6G (which gives you cancer) and microwaves to do all necessary computations on the server-side M Traction Control chip. It then beams it back to your car, but since the car is missing the necessary hardware to control wheel slip, it actually mind controls a nearby squirrel to hop on your drive shaft to do the job of the missing eLSD. I should've read your manual page more clearly, as this mechanism is objectively irrefutably described.

On a more serious note, if it makes you happier to believe you got a superior diff for $900, then I'm happy for ya. Have a good life, and I hope you enjoy your car!

[Berzerker]

Originally Posted by ember.m4

You're right, the evidence is truly indisputable. I must see past my denial. If you don't option M Traction Control, then MDM uses lvls 4-7 by connecting to the BMW cloud through 6G (which gives you cancer) and microwaves to do all necessary computations on the server-side M Traction Control chip. It then beams it back to your car, but since the car is missing the necessary hardware to control wheel slip, it actually mind controls a nearby squirrel to hop on your drive shaft to do the job of the missing eLSD. I should've read your manual page more clearly, as this mechanism is objectively irrefutably described.

On a more serious note, if it makes you happier to believe you got a superior diff for $900, then I'm happy for ya. Have a good life, and I hope you enjoy your car!

Nothing about the diff is "superior" and I never claimed as such. The controller that's added as part of the package is *not* a stock piece of the eLSD. You can think whatever you want all you want, but no amount of your pointless sarcasm is going to make you any more correct.

For the record, I don't have the M Drive Professional.

[ASAP]

it's funny because 90% of the new cars I've seen on the lots or ordered cars don't have M drive Pro... nor do used cars... which kind of blows my mind considering I would choose this over laser lights, exec pack, any carbon pack or leather... really, if I was to get a base car, it would have to have this... not sure what folks are thinking considering it's almost effectively the only option that defines how the car drives sans Xdrive / rwd

[Berzerker]

Originally Posted by ASAP

it's funny because 90% of the new cars I've seen on the lots or ordered cars don't have M drive Pro... nor do used cars... which kind of blows my mind considering I would choose this over laser lights, exec pack, any carbon pack or leather... really, if I was to get a base car, it would have to have this... not sure what folks are thinking considering it's almost effectively the only option that defines how the car drives sans Xdrive / rwd

I would be willing to bet money most people buy these cars to drive/daily them more than track them. Not to say people don't also track them, but the primary focus is going to be a street car, which those packages you listed are far more important IMO.

It's also not like not having the MDP system makes the car terrible on the track either.

[ASAP]

Originally Posted by Berzerker

I would be willing to bet money most people buy these cars to drive/daily them more than track them. Not to say people don't also track them, but the primary focus is going to be a street car, which those packages you listed are far more important IMO.

It's also not like not having the MDP system makes the car terrible on the track either.

You may be right... but in the end it's an M car and it defines how the car drives and can adjust traction settings... that could mean a ton on the street... whether you want it to get more loose or keep it more in check, this would literally be the option I would not skip. I would get it just for testing alone to see how much side slip angle i could get in corners... in an F80, I am willing to bet this would have like a 75% take rate given how key traction control was.

[ember.m4]

Originally Posted by ASAP

it's funny because 90% of the new cars I've seen on the lots or ordered cars don't have M drive Pro... nor do used cars... which kind of blows my mind considering I would choose this over laser lights, exec pack, any carbon pack or leather... really, if I was to get a base car, it would have to have this... not sure what folks are thinking considering it's almost effectively the only option that defines how the car drives sans Xdrive / rwd

Yeah, I think it's because it's a very obscure option that is hard for a non-car person to understand, let alone want. Nerds like us are in the minority of M owners, and dealers option cars for the masses so that they can sell them easier. Honestly, I'm not sure why BMW had to paywall this feature. They love doing dumb things like this. I guess I shouldn't be expecting more from a company that wants to charge heating subscriptions. My F-gen didn't have bluetooth music as an option, and it literally took me 5 minutes to code it in. Anything for more profit these days!

[ASAP]

Originally Posted by ember.m4

Yeah, I think it's because it's a very obscure option that is hard for a non-car person to understand, let alone want. Nerds like us are in the minority of M owners, and dealers option cars for the masses so that they can sell them easier. Honestly, I'm not sure why BMW had to paywall this feature. They love doing dumb things like this. I guess I shouldn't be expecting more from a company that wants to charge heating subscriptions. My F-gen didn't have bluetooth music as an option, and it literally took me 5 minutes to code it in. Anything for more profit these days!

Do you think non car people should be driving M cars? Again, this is an opinion that doesn't have a right or wrong answer... but more than anything it's very telling on which way the M car market went since the F gen.

[LuvMyE92]

Originally Posted by ember.m4

If you don't option M Traction Control, then MDM uses lvls 4-7 by connecting to the BMW cloud through 6G (which gives you cancer) and microwaves to do all necessary computations on the server-side M Traction Control chip.

If I wear my tin foil hat (or helmet liner, if I'm on the track) will that stop me from getting cancer?

Originally Posted by ASAP

it's funny because 90% of the new cars I've seen on the lots or ordered cars don't have M drive Pro... nor do used cars... which kind of blows my mind considering I would choose this over laser lights, exec pack, any carbon pack or leather... really, if I was to get a base car, it would have to have this... not sure what folks are thinking considering it's almost effectively the only option that defines how the car drives sans Xdrive / rwd

I got my car off the lot (presumably it was a custom ordered car that was not purchased) and it has MdP. In addition to everything described above, it also has "track mode" which automagically turns off all of the driving aids and the iDrive screen. My car has the superior and more attractive version 7 "two screen" edition.

I've never used MdP. If I ever get the chance to drive the car on a skidpad, then I may play with it, but on the street all the traction/stability controls are active, and on the track, everything is off.

I don't drift the car, ever. To me it's silly and abusive, and doesn't do the tires any good. OK, the real reason is that I don't have that skill.

I will add to the conversation that I believe that everything in MdP is software. I can't imagine what hardware could be present, and that clip from the owner's manual doesn't enlighten me at all.

And yes, I'm a little pissed that I spent $900 on something that I don't need or use, but that applies to laser lights as well, as I can't tell a difference. Maybe it will pay off when/if I ever sell this car, but I doubt it.