[NathObeaN]

Hi all,

I am considering moving from an M2 to M2 Competition and after some opinions around opting for the BBK/M-Sport Brake setup (optional in UK). These are my considerations so far:

For:
More stopping power. Haven't been overly impressed with my M2 in braking, even with RS29 pads.
Better braking kit from factory means I don't have to notify insurance about "upgraded brakes" - bonus.
A lot cheaper getting these from factory compared to buying separately.

Against:
More expensive from factory order.
There are lots of complaints of the BBK kits causing stone rubbing/scraping on OEM wheels. Is it really 'that' bad?
This car will develop into my go-to track car longer term. That said, I can always consider swapping out the brakes for aftermarket ones later on down the line to save on weight etc (also not prone to stone scraping). This unfortunately adds additional cost, notifying insurance etc.

Thoughts? Experiences?

Thanks all!

[HFW003]

No need in my opinion.

I find the brakes on mine extremely good under all conditions.

[mnbrennan]

I don't have any specific feedback on what is better, but I did order the 2NH option with my car. I just think they look far better than the blue brakes, the added stopping power is a bonus!

[NathObeaN]

Originally Posted by mnbrennan

I don't have any specific feedback on what is better, but I did order the 2NH option with my car. I just think they look far better than the blue brakes, the added stopping power is a bonus!

Any issues with stones getting stuck against the calliper and scraping the wheels?

[bri1042]

Originally Posted by NathObeaN

Any issues with stones getting stuck against the calliper and scraping the wheels?

Yes, this has happened to a lot of people. I wish had a choice on this in the US. I would not have gotten them (yes, they look nice, but they're heavy, have clearance issues, and restrict wheel choice too much).

[omasou]

There's no comparison though the blue brakes are good, the 2NH stopping power is another level.

I wouldn't say "a lot" of people have had a stone scratch the rim.

If worried, get the blue then add an aftermarket option that give more clearance.

[COChris]

Since you plan to track the car, get the blue brakes. Then remove them after you take delivery and throw on a BBK from Essex Racing. It's expensive up front, but your wheel and tire choices for track work will be 10 fold as you can run an 18" wheel. You will also save significant weight at each corner.

[VisualEcho]

If I was going to use this car as a track weapon there is no doubt in my mind that I'd have the BBS FI-R wheels because they're so light and strong. That right there puts the factory brake upgrade out of the question because it's super common to get those rock scores, and in the FI-R that means wheel replacement. Even for a daily I wouldn't have those brakes because of the stone scoring issue. Aftermarket FTW here. And as a bonus I believe all the aftermarket options are lighter (yes, I'm big on unsprung weight).

[2020M2Competition]

In the end it really comes down to your personal preference and budget.

It's very easy for us on the forum to spend other people's money

How much extra is the 2NH brake option?

How much tracking do you really intend to do?

The 2NH brakes are heavier and limit you to 19" wheels which can be legitimate concerns, but as omasou mentioned they really do offer a significant step up in braking performance over the standard brakes.

I have been very impressed with the 2NH brakes on my car so far after 7 track days with just basic upgrades (SS lines, new fluid, new pads and Ti shims)

An Essex competition brake kit (front and rear) starts around $8500 (without pads)

With options you're looking at $9000-$10000

That said, I do think they are one of if not the best kits out there for our platform

BBS FI-R wheels start around $8000

With tires mounted and balanced you're looking at $9000-$10000

Although they look great and are super light, I believe they are only available in very limited sizes with less than ideal offsets (especially in the rear)

19x9.5" ET22
19x10.5" ET35
20x9.5" ET22
20x10.5" ET35

[NathObeaN]

Originally Posted by 2020M2Competition

In the end it really comes down to your personal preference and budget.

It's very easy for us on the forum to spend other people's money

How much extra is the 2NH brake option?

How much tracking do you really intend to do?

The 2NH brakes are heavier and limit you to 19" wheels which can be legitimate concerns, but as omasou mentioned they really do offer a significant step up in braking performance over the standard brakes.

I have been very impressed with the 2NH brakes on my car so far after 7 track days with just basic upgrades (SS lines, new fluid, new pads and Ti shims)

An Essex competition brake kit (front and rear) starts around $8500 (without pads)

With options you're looking at $9000-$10000

That said, I do think they are one of if not the best kits out there for our platform

BBS FI-R wheels start around $8000

With tires mounted and balanced you're looking at $9000-$10000

Although they look great and are super light, I believe they are only available in very limited sizes with less than ideal offsets (especially in the rear)

19x9.5" ET22
19x10.5" ET35
20x9.5" ET22
20x10.5" ET35

Thanks, appreciate the input. How much stone scraping have you experienced?

[2020M2Competition]

Originally Posted by NathObeaN

Thanks, appreciate the input. How much stone scraping have you experienced?

I don't think I've had any stone scraping (such as a small rock or pebble getting stuck between a caliper and the wheel barrel creating a groove)

2000 miles on the stock 788M wheels and tires

3000 miles on 763M wheels and Cup 2 tires

However, that doesn't mean it can't or won't happen as it has definitely happened to others

Maybe I've just been lucky so far

[NathObeaN]

Originally Posted by 2020M2Competition

I don't think I've had any stone scraping (such as a small rock or pebble getting stuck between a caliper and the wheel barrel creating a groove)

2000 miles on the stock 788M wheels and tires

3000 miles on 763M wheels and Cup 2 tires

However, that doesn't mean it can't or won't happen as it has definitely happened to others

Maybe I've just been lucky so far

Hmmm. I think I am leaning to opt for them. In the UK it's £1350 with the car or around £4000 if you buy separately so quite a discount if ordered at factory. If they do end up scratching the wheels, I will just touch them up and convert them to daily/winter wheels at a later date. I won't be getting upgraded brakes for probably 2 years so may as well enjoy some better brakes at the track in the meantime.

[SeanWRT]

As a blue brake user for 4 years, I must say it's useful enough under all conditions except for REPEATED lapping. With brake fluid (and pad if necessary) upgrade, it can handle quite a job.

Remember, brake disc is only a thermal tank, nothing else. Before disc heat soak, all the brakes, be it 10-piston 800mm Lamborghini Mars Edition, or the one found on Prius, can be programmed (via master piston configuration) to perform identically or very closely.

I had experience with the 2NH brake, it instantly feels much stronger due to the larger diameter (larger brake torque arm). And I like it, despite of the fact that it's vastly more sensitive than a normal vehicle needs to be and thus can take some getting used to. However, the "bite" feel is just like the throttle mapping in engine tuning - you apply 30% and get responded with 50~60% output. Everyone has a different sensitivity point where they don't want more. 2NH for me is very close to that point. An over the top sample for me is the C63s amg ceramic brake, I had that and I hated it. It was so sensitive that normal tip-ins feels like an emergency stops. Not really able to drive normal with it.

For some reasons, I didn't see many 2NH at track, nor did I hear complaints about it. I'm assuming the track guys automatically saves money, skipping it to go directly to aftermarket ones. But from what I've got from the blue brake, 2NH definitely can take seriously more beating before it gives up, and that would be good enough for the most track guys.

[Montaver]

Originally Posted by VisualEcho

If I was going to use this car as a track weapon there is no doubt in my mind that I'd have the BBS FI-R wheels because they're so light and strong. That right there puts the factory brake upgrade out of the question because it's super common to get those rock scores, and in the FI-R that means wheel replacement. Even for a daily I wouldn't have those brakes because of the stone scoring issue. Aftermarket FTW here. And as a bonus I believe all the aftermarket options are lighter (yes, I'm big on unsprung weight).

No one at the track is running FI-R's. Beautiful wheels but for track use you can get the same performance for a quarter of the cost.

[VIERsr]

The main reason I went for the BBK is to avoid those awful blue calipers. The massive monoblock calipers and rotors are also a joy for your eyes.

[VisualEcho]

Originally Posted by Montaver

No one at the track is running FI-R's. Beautiful wheels but for track use you can get the same performance for a quarter of the cost.

I wasn't speaking of what other people run, only what I'd run. Also, show me the wheels you speak of that provide the same performance for a quarter of the price. I'm interested.

[Montaver]

Originally Posted by VisualEcho

I wasn't speaking of what other people run, only what I'd run. Also, show me the wheels you speak of that provide the same performance for a quarter of the price. I'm interested.

Titan7 TS-5, APEX EC7-R both forged lightweight options. Even that seems pricey for track wheels given the punishment they take (slamming curbs, high temp brake dust caking on the wheels, constant tire swaps etc). I'd love a set of FI-R's for the street though, they look fantastic on the M2.

[GoHerd]

My experience @ 4500 miles.

3 out of 4 788s have wear marks indicating something was lodged between the caliper and the barrel.

The rear marks have gone through the paint. The passenger front has a faint line.
Never hear any sound that would have alerted me to an issue while driving.

[VisualEcho]

Originally Posted by Montaver

Titan7 TS-5, APEX EC7-R both forged lightweight options. Even that seems pricey for track wheels given the punishment they take (slamming curbs, high temp brake dust caking on the wheels, constant tire swaps etc). I'd love a set of FI-R's for the street though, they look fantastic on the M2.

I don't think they are nearly as light as the FI-R.

But in any case, I wouldn't buy the FI-R new for the track, I'd pick up a fringe set. I've seen 2 for sale since I got here just a year ago. The combination of those wheels, lighter tires, and lighter brakes would be fantastic on such a heavy car.

[omasou]

One more data point.

On the M2, I've had rocks get stuck in the backing ~5x.

On the M2C, I think it happened once.

Knock on wood, on the M2C, none caught between the caliper and rim.

For me the initial bite of the 2NH was only a concern when I first bought the car. What I really like is how I can feather the brakes much better and when needed can stop on a dime.

Just make sure no one is following too close. I had a guy lock up his brakes b/c I was able to stop so quickly. I wasn't going fast and he wasn't tailing me but my stopping definitely took him by surprise.

[M2Cmtl]

2NH is standard in Canada but I would have gone with the blue brakes to save weight and allow for 18 inch wheels for winter.

[MystroX5]

OMG, the M2C brakes are on a different level than any oem brakes I have had from any of my 911’s. If anything the M2C is over braked with its 6 piston front and 4 piston rear. Very impressive.